Public Answer to Brad Larson for lpapp’s ban

Hi everyone, here you can read the public answer from lpapp to Brad Larson’s post.
This user had been warned by four moderators in six direct moderator messages and three suspensions prior to this. They had been suspended from Meta.SE separately at least once, in addition. They have been banned from chat on multiple occasions (currently serving a 30-day ban at the time this happened). They were repeatedly warned in comments and in chat by almost every single active moderator on the site.

1) Date: Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 7:42 PM by Andrew Barber

I was asked to take lengthy comments to Meta. Understanding that, I tried to follow this suggestion. It has no longer been such a big issue although I have been prefering comments lately. The lesson was learned. I am grateful for the moderators for their help. I appreciate that they showed me the significance of Meta back then. Thanks guys.

2) Date: Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 10:11 AM by Andrew Barber

I entered my first “serial downvoting” loop with more than three downvotes on a user who was frankly a newcomer, stubborn and incompetent. Even though he was not cool, I sincerely regret what I did and I admit that it was a mistake. Shame on me; slap me. Thanks again for the moderator warning.

3) Date: Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 4:57 AM by Jon Ericson

Unfortunately, I ran into the previous issue again, so my account was suspended for seven days. I more than well deserved it and completely agree with moderators here. At this point, I finally realized that serial downvoting, even if it is just 3-4 votes against bad quality content, is not the way forward. This has not been an issue anymore as far as I can tell to run into “serial downvoting”. Lesson learned. Thanks to the moderators for the help. Again, I appreciate this because it is really better to never engage in serial downvoting.

= ABOUT 9-12 MONTHS LATER and not due to inactivity (no grudges held?) =

4) Date: Tue, Jul 22, 2014 at 5:07 PM by Shog9

After a couple of post disassociations on Meta as-per the creative commons license as recommended to me by some old contributors, I got banned for a month. This was the first ban which I think was strange coming without prior warning out of the thin air.

I definitely did not agree with Shog9 about this (unlike in the previous cases), but I did accept his viewpoint regardless. I think it is quite silly to ban someone for a month due to that, but despite my opinion, I moved on and noted that I should not do this ever again. As far as I can tell, I’ve stuck to this.

I accepted that disassociation is not simple through the SE platform, so it is better to avoid posting to Meta. SE also suggested to create a puppet account, which I did not want to do. It was better for me to stop asking questions. By this time, I figured that it would be best to remove my meta account or the hot posts on the right side of the main site, but this is not an option; they are forced on us.

I reached the stage where I learned from and respected the type of issues that resulted in previous bans. I have not repeated the same behaviour again. I think Brad Larson is unfair when he writes I did not improve my behavior towards the “code of conduct” of the site. Since these issues not happened again, I’d call it as an improvement. Brad, I do not mean to argue, but honestly, I have tried to do my best. If you really do not see progress here, it would be nice to sit down and work out a plan to help me improve on this, beyond simply trying not to repeat them. I am all ears and appreciate feedback.

5) Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 11:40 PM by Shog9

I got a one day ban. He mentioned that to me that I harrassed people linking these two threads:

1) http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/277923/are-your-code-works-fine-for-me-answers-acceptable/277924#277924

and

2) http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/277859/failed-audit-why-is-this-a-good-question

As you can see, the former case shows that several people agreed with me and since the comments are still there, it has not been deemed offensive, let alone abusive. As for the second, I realize that the community does not agree with my opinion, so I removed my comments pretty much within 1-2 hours (as far as memory serves) without moderator intervention.

I tried to ask for further feedback as well as requesting the messages to be made public so that others can see. Even at the time of writing this, sadly I did not get a green light, so I am trying to explain it from my perspective. I would have so much loved to discuss these comments with them in a peaceful environment where we can sit down, but this has not come to happen.

Furthermore, as you can see, these two threads are on Meta, so even if was abusive (which was not my intention), that is no reason to suspend my account on Stack Overflow in my humble opinion with due respect. I think if it has been determined that someone has been abusive on one site, that should not automatically disqualify that person from other sites where there have not been such concerns.

They banned me for a year for being abusive. I have tried to ask SE and the mods several times for concrete examples, but unfortunately I have not received any. Moreover, I have asked to allow me to make all the conversation public, but they didn’t reply to that, either. Perhaps, others could have helped me to interpret their messages if the language barrier is making things more difficult for all concerned.

They have been banned from chat on multiple occasions (currently serving a 30-day ban at the time this happened).

I am sorry Brad, but that is just incorrect. I was not serving a 30-day ban. In fact, I was quite active in the Close/Delete voters chat room right before the ban and I do not remember a single chat ban on Stack Overflow. I humbly request to be careful when stating such things publicly. Since I cannot reply, it’s very important to get the details correct, in the interests of fairness.

Overall, this is a a really sad situation that we have to “communicate” like this other than sitting down in a chat room, Skype, or anywhere where we can peacefully discuss all what bug us. All of us are here to make the site better, even if some people think I am not. I would have really appreciated clear communication with proper conversation between us. Moderators usually just criticised, and hardly replied to further inquiries making it more of a monologue than a dialogue, sadly.

I still hope that Brad, Shog9, Andrew and everyone else involved can sit down with me to discuss it. I am not referring to ban lifting, but even if I ever come back to the site, I cannot see how this issue could be resolved without clear “off-comment” and “off-Q/A” communication between us and honestly, I have personally missed that. It is a bit of shame, really. I think this could all have been avoided with such “back-channel” communication.

I wrote to the SE staff a couple of days ago to peacefully discuss my case. Let us see what happens. In the meantime, if moderators would like to sit down for a discussion or just to answer questions that I sent to them already, they are more than welcome. My private email address is lpapp at archlinux.us. I hope we can get in touch for such a discussion rather than communicating like this. It benefits no-one I believe.

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